2.1.0 Reverb bug

Please let our ADS show!

This sites offers only FREE software and it's supported by a few advertisement boxes (no intrusive popups).
Please:

  • disable your AdBlocker by adding CoolSoft website to whitelist
  • give the proper cookie consent
  • enable JavaScript for this website

This seconds wait is to let you update your browser configuration...

Ok, I've done the required changes... now show me your content!
!!! Please enable JavaScript !!!

Pages

Posts: 47
Joined: April 25, 2016 - 12:19
Re: 2.1.0 Reverb bug

After a reboot, there's no noticeable reverb or chorus, or it's just low. Very dry sound.

http://kiwi6.com/artists/GEN_MIDI

Posts: 1687
Joined: March 25, 2012 - 01:19
Re: 2.1.0 Reverb bug

I think I've finally found what was wrong in Reverb/Chorus setting management.
Under certain conditions their values were simply... uninitialized, so they could get any value (at startup).
This almost never happens in DEBUG builds; that's why it was so difficult for me to reproduce it on my side (I usually run VMS in DEBUG...).
The attached beta2 fixes it.

The new beta also overrides standard MIDI Reverb (91) and Chorus (93) controller messages in addition to the (already managed) SYSEX ones.

Please report if it works correctly.

UPDATE: released 2.3.1-beta3, see below

Posts: 47
Joined: April 25, 2016 - 12:19
Re: 2.1.0 Reverb bug

After a clean install, I just had the same problem as last time, full reverb and chorus. Also happened after a reboot.

Another minor problem; even though I have selected to never check for updates, I always get a popup when starting VMS saying a new version is available (even happens with v2.0.1).

http://kiwi6.com/artists/GEN_MIDI

Posts: 1687
Joined: March 25, 2012 - 01:19
Re: 2.1.0 Reverb bug
Kj wrote:
After a clean install, I just had the same problem as last time, full reverb and chorus. Also happened after a reboot.

Could you please post an updated debug report (Configurator | About | Debug report...)?

Kj wrote:
Another minor problem; even though I have selected to never check for updates, I always get a popup when starting VMS saying a new version is available (even happens with v2.0.1).

This issue should have been fixed some versions ago, don't know why you're still having it...
I'd like to have a look at the debug report.

Posts: 47
Joined: April 25, 2016 - 12:19
Re: 2.1.0 Reverb bug

I very nearly did upload another debug report, instead I uninstalled and went back to version 2.0.1.

Back to the latest beta for the debug report (and then back again). lol

Attachments (Only registered users)
VirtualMIDISynth_debug_report.txt

http://kiwi6.com/artists/GEN_MIDI

Posts: 1687
Joined: March 25, 2012 - 01:19
Re: 2.1.0 Reverb bug

In the attached debug report I see both Reverb and Chorus options set to 127 in configuration file:

[Advanced]
...
ReverbLevel=127
ChorusLevel=127
...

Could you please reinstall 2.3.1-beta2 then check options values both in config file and in Options tab?
Set them both to 0 in Options tab and check their value in VirtualMIDISynth.conf file...

Posts: 47
Joined: April 25, 2016 - 12:19
Re: 2.1.0 Reverb bug

I just tested it as suggested, and the changes do save correctly in the config file.

I've always allowed for the maximum setting of both reverb and chorus, but now it is forcing that amount rather than simply allowing soundfonts to use up to that amount.

http://kiwi6.com/artists/GEN_MIDI

Posts: 1687
Joined: March 25, 2012 - 01:19
Re: 2.1.0 Reverb bug
Kj wrote:
...rather than simply allowing soundfonts to use up to that amount.

After reading the bolded text I've had an epiphany about what's going on..., let's recap step by step:
you wrote "use up to that amount", that means you think that those options configure the max allowed reverb and chorus values.

"But that's not the intended usage", I thought!
while taking a screenshot of the options page to support my next reply, I read (with close attention) the English translation of those options: "Reverb max level"... (I'm in charge of the English translation ;))
Well, honestly speaking, I don't know how that "max" came out of the blue, but that's definitely not the right translation and it does not correctly describe what those options are for.

The intended usage was to provide a default initial value to Reverb and Chorus, not limit their max allowed value.
In fact the title of the box that groups the two values is "Default GS/XG MIDI effects values".
Marking the "Override received MIDI SYSEX messages" checkbox will enforce it by discarding effect changes received through MIDI.

So the english translations should read: "Reverb default level" and "Chorus default level".

I'm sorry for the misunderstanding and will fix the english translation ASAP.
Will also ask translators to update other languages too.

Posts: 47
Joined: April 25, 2016 - 12:19
Re: 2.1.0 Reverb bug

That would make sense, but still something strange is happening. Ever since late April 2016 I've been working on my own soundfont, and from whatever version of VMS was available then right up to 2.0.1 those reverb and chorus settings worked as max allowed rather then set as (for me, at least).

I've spent a lot of time adjusting and evaluating reverb and chorus settings, and there is an immeasurable amount of combinations you can set between preset global settings, individual instruments in presets, instruments gloabal settings, and individual samples in instruments. It's essential to keep this soundfont information, and not just have VMS coat it all with a single value each for reverb and chorus. Is there a way to bypass these settings in VMS? I tried installing the latest beta again and unchecking the 'overide received MIDI SysEx messages' option but it made no difference, VMS' reverb and chorus settings remained active. Some sort of check box to 'use soundfonts' settings' is desperately needed!

Here's a wave file demonstration of what I mean; my soundfont's balanced settings alone used with VMS 2.0.1 which allows for the soundfont's individual preset and instrument settings, and then when used with VMS 2.3.1b settings which swamp the sound with reverb and chorus and make it much less realistic:

https://1drv.ms/u/s!ApDMaHDx0bwNgScBt0O_i7vXdtNQ End Credits GEN MIDI sf2 - VMS 201.wav

https://1drv.ms/u/s!ApDMaHDx0bwNgSgWBB_rhuot3u5M End Credits - VMS 231b2.wav

(Open in a new tab or window and choose download in the top left corner).

http://kiwi6.com/artists/GEN_MIDI

Posts: 1687
Joined: March 25, 2012 - 01:19
Re: 2.1.0 Reverb bug

Well, till the latest version VMS only changed GS/XG reverb and sustain, standard MIDI Reverb/Chorus controllers (91/93) were just ignored.

Kj wrote:
Is there a way to bypass these settings in VMS? I tried installing the latest beta again and unchecking the 'overide received MIDI SysEx messages' option but it made no difference, VMS' reverb and chorus settings remained active.

It all started in VMS1 when someone pointed out that BASS applied a default Reverb/Sustain level to MIDI synthesis; it seems that it starts with a default value of 64 which seemed way too high for some users.
Then the needing to set it to a custom value, and this is the intended usage of that setting.

Kj wrote:
Some sort of check box to 'use soundfonts' settings' is desperately needed!

BASS should add Reverb/Chorus effects AFTER the rendering, so setting those options (now that they work correctly in 2.3.1b) to 0 should set a flat additional effect.
Removing default value is risky: if you play a MIDI that sets Reverb controler to 15, then a MIDI that sets it to 100, then a third MIDI that doesn't set it at all... the third will be played with Reverb value set by its preceding file (100).

The "Override messages" (now "Override received reverb/chorus MIDI messages") tells VMS to just ignore any Reverb/Chorus change request received through MIDI Controller Change messages (91/93) or GS/XG SysEX messages.

That said, I suppose you should set them both to 0 and uncheck the option.

Pages