Can VirtualMIDISynth handle keygroups?

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Posts: 43
Joined: May 20, 2018 - 02:30
Can VirtualMIDISynth handle keygroups?

It's a long time I'm searching why some midis have playback problems.
It seems I found out whats going on maybe, so I have to ask:

Can VirtualMIDISynth handle "keygroups" like kg 1 for highat on drumkit settings? Sometimes it seems to work but if it goes faster its like I have not enough voices and cuts it half. So it sounds "bugged". So its my question. If i tested it on Ian Luck XmPlay it worked without any problems. I tested player like winamp and media player and there its bugged. To fix my problem at the moment I have to disable the keygroup feature on my soundfont. How can I fix it with keygroup?

Here I uploaded a sample midi. First its starting with keygroup enable. After this disable.

greetings. =)

Attachments (Only registered users)
Keygroup test.rar
Posts: 1877
Joined: March 25, 2012 - 01:19
Re: Can VirtualMIDISynth handle keygroups?

Even if I wrote VMS, well... I'm not a MIDI expert at all, especially on advanced MIDI/SF2 features like this 🙄.

VMS doesn't change the incoming MIDI stream (except for Reverb/Chorus control messages, a feature I regretted of just after its release 🤐😉).
It only reads it to detect mode changes (GM/GM2/GS/XG) and show program names and activity.
All the content is sent to BASSMIDI library.

ex-driver wrote:
If i tested it on Ian Luck XmPlay it worked without any problems.

This is really interesting, because they (should) share the same BASSMIDI codebase, except for version-related differences.
Could you tell me the exact XMPlay+MIDIPlugin versions, so I can compare them with VMS+BASSMIDI versions?

ex-driver wrote:
its like I have not enough voices and cuts it half

Well, have you checked the Options|Midi synthesis|Maximum number of notes... configuration parameter?
Isn't that the culprit?

Posts: 43
Joined: May 20, 2018 - 02:30
Re: Can VirtualMIDISynth handle keygroups?

Hi. Again. ;)

My VMS settings is 512 Polyphony. I set it to max but i didn't change the problem.

My XMPlay uses the Version rev.17. Pic is added with settings.

This problem exist longer but its a long time had to find out what's going on. I remembered BassMIDI from kode54 had the same bug.

Its only appearing if the rythm is more complicated. I noticed it too on descent MIDIS from DOS Game. Both MIDIs are GM. I hope it could help to find whats going on. I dont remember it appears on GS or XG. So it seems only GM Midis.

Attachments (Only registered users)
Unbenannt.jpg
Posts: 43
Joined: May 20, 2018 - 02:30
Re: Can VirtualMIDISynth handle keygroups?

Yes it seems. It appears only on GM Midis. GS/XG work fine. I tested today many MIDIS.

Posts: 43
Joined: May 20, 2018 - 02:30
Re: Can VirtualMIDISynth can't handle keygroups on GM Mode?

I opened soundfonts like GM.dls from Microsoft. the keygroup there is active for kg1 hi hats

On creative default soundfonts 2,4,8 mb disabled. other custom midis activated the kg1 too.

So Virtual MIDI can handle keygroups yes but at the Moment not correctly on GM mode.

The Problem is if i disabled the kg. The hi hats works not correctly on GM mode on other MIDIS. (too short play). The keygroup trigger the hi hat how to work. Close fast or close slow for example.

You can check the GM problem on normal MIDIS like the Descent 1 MIDIS from Dosgame. "credits" the last 20 seconds. if kg1 is active.

Roland and XG works correct.

It would be nice it could fixed. So i would donate this fix ;).

greetings

I like the Virtual MIDI Synth really =)

Posts: 1877
Joined: March 25, 2012 - 01:19
Re: Can VirtualMIDISynth can't handle keygroups on GM Mode?
ex-driver wrote:
So Virtual MIDI can handle keygroups yes but at the Moment not correctly on GM mode.

The fact is that VMS does not have any code to patch/handle MIDI stream at all (except for intercepting MIDI mode to show it on Mixer)... 🙄

coolsoft wrote:
Could you tell me the exact XMPlay+MIDIPlugin versions, so I can compare them with VMS+BASSMIDI versions?

Please post this info so I can investigate in this.

Posts: 111
Joined: September 25, 2013 - 16:38
Re: Can VirtualMIDISynth can't handle keygroups on GM Mode?
coolsoft wrote:
ex-driver wrote:
So Virtual MIDI can handle keygroups yes but at the Moment not correctly on GM mode.

The fact is that VMS does not have any code to patch/handle MIDI stream at all (except for intercepting MIDI mode to show it on Mixer)... 🙄

coolsoft wrote:
Could you tell me the exact XMPlay+MIDIPlugin versions, so I can compare them with VMS+BASSMIDI versions?

Please post this info so I can investigate in this.

It's rather pointless to compare VMS to XMPlay's Midi plugin since XMPlay does not use real-time Midi functions like Bass_Midi_Streamevent(s) but it plays the Midi file internally. This can result in differences when precision is important. Currently the maximum Midi timing precision in case of Bassmidi's real-time functions is equal to the update period (that is 5 ms in the best case). But BassMidi's internal file based playback (e.g. Bass_Midi_StreamCreateFile) has no such limitation, it can be even sub-millisecond precise.

So I do not think this problem has anything to do with GM/GS/XG. It is just a coincidence that all the problematic files were GM.

Reference:
https://www.un4seen.com/forum/?topic=19693.msg137818#msg137818

 

Posts: 43
Joined: May 20, 2018 - 02:30
Re: Can VirtualMIDISynth can't handle keygroups on GM Mode?

My XMplay Version is 3.8.5 and midi rev.17. So maybe thats a problem still on BASSmidi.dll as falco said. But why are the GS/XG working better with faster actions like techno/ dance. So it should appear there too. But it doesn't. Thats what im not understand.

whats going on there?

Posts: 111
Joined: September 25, 2013 - 16:38
Re: Can VirtualMIDISynth can't handle keygroups on GM Mode?
ex-driver wrote:

My XMplay Version is 3.8.5 and midi rev.17. So maybe thats a problem still on BASSmidi.dll as falco said. But why are the GS/XG working better with faster actions like techno/ dance. So it should appear there too. But it doesn't. Thats what im not understand.

whats going on there?

You should try my test version which has the workaround applied (it uses the same real-time functions as VMS).

First download the full version

https://falcosoft.hu/midiplayer_60_bse.zip

Then overwrite the files in the main folder with the ones you can find in the x86 folder:

https://falcosoft.hu/midiplayer_61_test.zip

If this version solves your problem then Claudio can apply the same new BassMidi flag to enable more precise real-time events when the new version of Bassmidi will be released.

Posts: 43
Joined: May 20, 2018 - 02:30
Re: Can VirtualMIDISynth can't handle keygroups on GM Mode?

Thx for your hard work guys. !!

I tested GM MIDI files again and on slow MIDIS its going better with this fix. Only decent MIDI "credits" has still problems with fast rythm on highhat. It seems we are on the right way. I used the VSTI/USE BASS right menu the other was midi mapper that didn't change anything.

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